Re: List Moderation

["" <april_biccum@xxxxxxxxxxx>]

Hi,

I'm an infrequent and recent lurker on the list and I don't really know what
this is all about, but I just want to say to you Ralph, before you sign off
(if that's your intention)that a lot of what you say below, particularly
with respect to the questions around modernity you raised and the black
American intellectuals you mention (every one should read Gilroy's _The
Black Atlantic_ in my opinion)that you're making sense to me.  I think the
questions you raise are crucial, of paramount importance and something every
self-respecting "radical" should humbly think hard upon.

April


>Until someone substantively addresses the substance of my posts on jazz,
>Adonro's aesthetics, etc., I am bowing out while others hypocritically
>pontificate and cover themselves, but I should be allowed a final word on
>who did what.
>
>Jukka must have a short memory if he doesn't think I've had anything to
>contribute ot the discussion of aesthetics.  E-mail discussions are
>inherently fragmentary, but you will recall I posted several abstracts of
>articles on jazz, Adorno, etc., a summary of Jauss's criticisms of Aodrno's
>aesthetic theory, my own commnents on all of this and suggestions for how
>to begin to think of these issues, etc.
>
>As for insults, aside from Gelding's initial insult to Spencer, I've been
>accused of anti-intellectualism, intellectual incompetence, misogyny (how
>did that get in there? or is it obligatory among the PC crowd?) ....
>everything but the one thing I could obviously be accused of ....
>Germanophobia (guilty as charged).  The hypocrites go for the jugular when
>they're caught with their pants down, don't they?
>
>My cardinal sin that towers above all is that I start with the presumption
>of denying that noether Adorno, Bloch, nor any of their peers are
>authoritoes in this area, hence it's not a question of proving them wrong,
>but of porving that they have any value at all applied to this subject
>matter.  It is a reversal--arrogant if you will--of the fundamental
>assumptions of who constitutes a respectable authority.  The one thing I
>did not do was pull the stunts you people are notorious for:  I did not
>call Adorno or Bloch racists for their provincialism, nor did I call y'll
>racists for yours.  But if I were to descend to your level, it would have
>been the easiest label to toss about, and it wouldn't be hard to make it
>stick.  But that is an academic liberal trick, not out of my bag.
>
>If one wnats to begin with the study of New World cultures, one needs to
>know a whole different set of facts and theoretical approaches, for they
>did not arive at the current state of capitalist culture through the same
>trajectory as our European friends for whom we name this list.  What was
>the cultural industry of colonial Trinidad in 1915?  Do any of you know?
>Is the sort of cultural totalitarianism perpetrated by colonialism, say, in
>the West Indies, the same sort as what you find in western Europe in he
>1920s and 1930s?  Have you ever thought about that?
>As as for a more advanced captialist society--the USA--say in the
>1920s--can one presume the same relatinship between commercial culture and
>the folk elements of the subcultures of the USA as obtain in Europe?  How
>do we theorize modernity as experienced by its first victims--African
>slaves?  Once we begin by questioning the presumption and arrogance of the
>Frankfurt Wankers on this list, we could suggest a whole line of other
>people to read in order to get ourselves oriented for this line of inquiry.
>  In addition to some of the sources I've suggested, and the myriad of
>works
>on jazz and black culture in general, we could even begin with a list of
>other "authorities" to study, say those who have provided a perspective on
>New World modernity: C.L.R. James, Richard Wright, Ralph Ellison, Paul
>Gilroy.
>
>The cardinal sin I have committed is to deny your authority, as a first
>premise for serious discussion, and that is the source of your predictable
>whining.  Even my praise for those aspects of the Frankfurter tradition I
>admire could not dissuade you, for you are a closed shop.  Your embrace of
>the Franks is so tied to your own socialization as functionaries in the
>knowledge industry, you can't see how uncreative and tedious you really
>are.  Everything you write reeks of the managerialist mentality.  You are
>not radical, you are only liberal.  You are the polar opposite of Adorno,
>who was at least humble about recognizing the place of the intellectual in
>the division of labor, as stodgy and morose as he was in other areas.
>
>At 01:56 AM 5/24/99 EET+0200, Jukka Laari wrote:
> >Firstly, Ralph Dumain clearly over-reacted. And when he was asked
> >about his conceptions on aesthetics he refused to answer. Instead
> >he did what he did (what was it? I'm not sure I know that).
> >
> >If these lists are discussion lists, then it should be clear that
> >everyone is obliged to answer questions, to clarify his or her >views
>....
>
>You know full well that Adorno and Marcuse opposed clarity as a concession
>to the status quo.  Do you not find this plea, um, rather ironic when you
>think about it?
>


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