RE: Re: RE: Taliban retreats

["Brownson, Jamil" <JBrownson@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

re: " ... kites"? Again, was my comment misunderstood?

Viz: the final stand of whomever in Kunduz or elsewhere under the terror of
saturation bombardment; all soldiers can relate to the fear, anger, pain,
agony, exhiliration and comradeship of battle. Perhaps even more so if you
all know that there is no escape from becoming another magnled corpse like
those around you. As a veteran I hate war more than anything else as each
report or photo causes flashbacks, that I would love to be free from, but
that are too deeply carved into me. However much I know about my fellow
human beings, it is still inconcievable to me how anyone, military or
civilian, could gloat over the horror and terror of death and destruction
that modern weaponry inflicts on human bodies, emotions, and surrounding
landscapes. Therefore, I do not express solidarity with any particular class
or cause, ethnos, or religion, and certainly not with jingo patriotism of
any stripe, only with the human beings trapped in war.

-----Original Message-----
From: Stephen E Philion [mailto:philion@xxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2001 11:20 AM
To: 'pen-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx'
>Subject: [PEN-L:19664] Re: RE: Taliban retreats


Workers of the world unite, you have nothing to lose but your kites!!

Steve



On Fri, 16 Nov 2001, Brownson, Jamil wrote:

> Karl, excellent analysis! Afghan loyalties have alwasy been close to home
> but mercenary in relation to outsiders, even when "outside" is at a
tribal,
> ethnic, or regional level, much less any grand "national" or ideological
> scheme, such as propagated by Taliban.
>
> You are correct to point out that Taliban had few really significant
> military "victories" in the field, and those were largely due to support
by
> Pakistani military /ISI "advisors". Whle their initial success was due to
> perception of them as a clean new actor in the chaos of civil war, their
> subsequent dogmatic and capricious rule endeared them to few if any
> Afghanis, including most of their allies and recruits. Marx's line "all
> that's solid melts into air" has many uses.
>
>
> As to the "hard core" Taliban and their "foreign" supporters going down in
a
> hellish fire of bombs & munitions, I have deep compassion for them despite
> repudiation of their fanaticism. To be a mujahihadeen is an honorable
> identity, albeit perhaps mislpaced in this context. But if many of these
men
> were veterans of wars for liberation of Muslim lands and peoples from true
> state terrorists such as Soviet & Russian successors, then they deserve
> compassion at the very least in their final end of unimaginable agony.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Karl Carlile [mailto:dagda@xxxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2001 10:51 PM
> To: communism@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [PEN-L:19654] Taliban retreats
>
>
> A study of the history of the Taliban with regard to its take over of most
> of
> Afghanistan will show that it had not demonstrated any particular skill on
> the
> battlefield. The Taliban had made many of its gains as a result of
> defections
> due to sizable payments to the appropriate commanders or due switching
sides
> so
> as to be on the winning side. The Taliban when it did do battle suffered
> some
> serious blows.
>
> It is clear that this process has been reversed. The significant
defections
> away
> from the Taliban helps explain much of the gains from those that now
oppose
> them. Those among the Taliban that are putting up a fierce and tenactious
> resistance are more than likely the core of the Taliban and OBL's armed
> group.
>
> Indeed it was a demonstration of the bankruptcy of the Taliban that should
> have
> tried to hold on to so much territory under the circumstances. Some weeks
> ago I
> pointed out that if I were Taliban I would have retreated from the cities
> and
> kept my army in tact. This would have left me in a better position to
resist
> and
> even mount an offensive againt Western forces.
>
> Karl Carlile
> Be free to visit the web site of the Communist Global Group at
> http://homepage.eircom.net/~beprepared/
>
>