Re: Re: Re: oil and socialism

[Gar Lipow <lipowg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

If there is a crisis -- it won't be particularly good for socialism, or
even for liberalism. Depends on how far it goes of course; if it comes
in 20 years, with 12 billion people suddenly trying to survive as hunter
gatherers, then neither capitalism or socialism will be the issue.

The question is will capitalism be flexible enough to avoid this crisis.
I guess I am now little Mary Sunshine on this list (God knows what Kelly
will do with that straight line). I still maintain that avoiding the
crisis is TECHNICALLY feasible; and capitalism could not only survive,
but thrive in a world with "soft" technology. The problem seems to be
that it isn't making the transition. Maybe for for once the institutions
captialism has created will prevent it from reacting to a crisis in time
-- if so, not to anyones benefit.

Ken Hanly wrote:
>
> So there will be a crisis but this will not guarantee the collapse of
> capitalism. In the great depression people could not afford cars or fuel to
> run them. The result: Bennett buggies: hooking up cars to horses so they
> were no longer horseless carriages.
> There was no revolution. Surely leftists should by now realise the ability
> of capitalism to survive contradictions of its own making at least in the
> short run. What is the suggested strategy of those who paint these gloomsday
> scenarios re energy in the near future. What is their view of what is to be
> done?
>     Cheers, Ken Hanly
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Michael Perelman <michael@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <pen-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Saturday, November 18, 2000 2:39 PM
> Subject: [PEN-L:4614] Re: oil and socialism
>
> > Gar is certainly correct that many potentially energy-saving strategies
> > exist.  However, implementation of these strategies also requires
> > considerable amounts of fossil fuel.  In addition, implementation will
> > require a good deal of time.
> >
> > For example, society could save enormous energy by redesigning cities to
> > minimize transportation demands.  It could not, however, do so
> > instantaneously.  Nor could we modernize the entire automobile fleet
> > overnight.  Finally, keep in mind that some of these energy-saving
> strategies
> > have problems of their own.  Not just hydroelectric power, but even wind.
> > For example in California, the windmills are creating havoc for bird
> > populations.
> >
> > --
> >
> > Michael Perelman
> > Economics Department
> > California State University
> > Chico, CA 95929
> >
> > Tel. 530-898-5321
> > E-Mail michael@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >