Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: [Fwd: Position in the World-System andNational Emissions of]

[Carrol Cox <cbcox@xxxxxxxxx>]

Louis Proyect wrote:

> Well, at least Ernest was a revolutionary socialist, even if he hadn't give
> ecology the full attention it deserved. We need more people like him
> nowadays

Actually, the question I have been trying to somehow ask (I haven't got
it right yet) in this debate (both earlier on Marxism and now on pen-l)
might be phrased as "How do we get more people like him?" You
affirm (but I don't think you actually defend) the proposition that we
get more people like him by carrying on a theoretical debate inside
marxism over how marxism relates to ecology. (I know that isn't
quite right -- but everyone has read the posts and can make the
necessary connections.)

My hypothesis has been that the way to get a real environmental movement
going is by indirection not direction. That before a socialist movement can
be directed towards environmental ends a socialist movement must exist --
and that only to a limited extent can environmental concerns be the cutting
edge of creating such a movement. This is what I was trying to get at
in my post to Charles. You took off on my reference to Harvey. You
may be correct or incorrect on that -- and if you are correct, you scored
a debating point. If you are incorrect you lost a debating point. In either
case you deflected both of us from the questions at issue.

Carrol