IMPORTANT: If you cite this message, OPE-L policy requires you not to reveal the identity of the author.
You may cite this message only if you do not disclose who wrote it.
Jerry You raise two issues: 1) use value 2) class struggle. 1) It is true that in my 'narrow' value form theory use value is treated merely as a bearer of value and up to the general formula of capital it has no specific economic bearing. However, with the turn to the study of production, and especially with my (delayed) introduction of the labour theory of determination of magnitude of value, I present the process of the subsumption of the material side by the formal side as a process of negativity. Rob A, by contrast insists that from the start this latter process of management of UV should be central. For example I derive money purely from the need for value to autonomise itself. Rob like the Uno school generally (see Lapavitsas) takes it in the context of circulating use value. In my HM reply to critics I went so far as to deny there is a dialectic of value and use value on the grounds that these were not true opposites in that while value certainly presupposes (negatively to be sure) use value, use value does not need value to complete its concept. They are not like north and south. This may have been too strict; for once subsumed under the value form use value can only realise itself through sale. I need to think more about this. 2) I agree with Rob A that class struggle is a sociological and historical phenomenon that might well be left to 'stages theory'. However the very fact there is class struggle must come out of the pure theory in some way. Here I agree with Mike L that it is part of concept of capital that it realises itself only through 'negating its negation' namely the workers. The term 'pure theory' is ambiguous. It can refer to the general character of capital distinguished from the specificities of stages of development. I would be happy to call my work pure theory in that sense. It can also mean pure in the sense of logical which seems to be the Sekine/Albritton reading of Uno. Here i dissent because I think it is part of the concept of capital that the logic of form finds itself struggling with the recalcitrance of the material factors subsumed under the form. At the level of circulation this may be ignored but not at the level of production where capital faces the subjectivity of workers. It is true one may abstract from the 'class for itself' but we must look at the 'class in itself' or 'in relation to capital' where it, however incohately, may be expected to resist being treated simply as capital's own use value, variable capital, human resources etc. For example we do not need to study the struggle over the working day - but we know this is a variable in which there is right against right and force decides; we also know that within a given working day force will determine the intensity of labour. Now Rob A will say 1) the value form manages the material factors through wages and rents, and 2) in order to exhibit the pure logic of capital we must make the methodological assumption (backed up by the real tendency) that labour is totally reified and at the disposal of capital. Here I would appeal to the dialectical point that the 'positive' and the outcome of 'negation of the negation' are different. That capital succeeds most of time in really subsuming labour, or may be methodologically taken to have done so, still leaves it the case that it rests on this process of negativity, always renewed and in principle never assured, of gaining hegemony over labour such that value is defined by me as reified labour. In fact Rob's conjectures about why I want to include the subjectivity of the workers in the concept of capital are off the mark. My real motivation is that I cannot understand what justification there can possibly be for a labour theory of value unless this specific fact about labour is basic. Otherwise labour is a resource like any other and there is no reason to prioritise it in our theory. To put the point against Rob. If his strictly logical account of capital were to be taken seriously he has no justification for a labour theory of value (that must surely have something to do with the use value of labour power) or if he accepts the labour theory of value then non-logical facts such as that workers can produce more than they consume must be admitted into pure theory. Chris On 25 Mar 2006, at 13:47, glevy@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
Hi Chris,
You didn't see Robbie's review in _La Travail_ and I haven't read the exchange between the two of you in _Historical Materialism_. But, it may indeed be the case that similar points were made in each, especially since he wrote in the review that he would "condense this discussion down to two fundamental points". I brought the review to the attention of the list because I thought that the same criticism that he made about your alleged "incoherence" could also be extended to some others on the list.
First, a side point. Robbie claims that:
"The basic problem is that in Capital the basic contradiction is between value and use-value from the beginning. By pushing use-value into the background, Arthur makes capital into pure form, which in turn leads him to overemphasize the role of pure form determination in the entire theory."
but this doesn't sound right: in your theory is use-value pushed into the background?
It is the next section that could have been written as a criticism of the perspectives of many others on this list:
"This leads to incoherence because he then wavers between emphasizing the preeminance of value form theory, on the one hand, and the claim that "value is the outcome of class struggle at the point of production" (57) on the other. If we take this latter claim seriously, then the laws of motion of capital disappear altogether, since we cannot generalize about value beyond saying that it varies with the balance of class forces in each factory. The problem is that he defeats his own dialectic by first evacuating use-value and then returning to it with such a vengeance. It is fine to claim that "labour is in and against capital;" but at the level of systematic dialectics, we cannot give the "against" any specific content, precisely because at this level the labour market, periodic crises, etc. regulate wages and the supply of labour. Again, it is not a question of denying labourers all subjectivity, but of seeing capital's commodification of labour-power as successfully channelling that subjectivity into channels supportive of profit maximization. For example, workers are free to quit any job, but at this level of abstraction, we assume that any other job will have similar wages and working conditions. Workers are free to bargain for the highest wages possible, but this bargaining power is undermined by the fact that in pure capitalism we cannot assume the existence of trade unions and by periodic crises that produce high unemployment. 8 Arthur again falls towards incoherence when he argues that the systematic dialectic of capital has two subjects - capital and labour. If labour is outside capital, then the dialectic must be of capital and labour - two totalities and their interrelations. Arthur tries to say that there is really one totality, but labour is relatively autonomous within this totality. But if labour is even relatively outside, it can continually disrupt the dialectic in unpredictable ways thus preventing it having any coherence. In order to have a coherent theory of capital's inner logic, we must assume that labour power has been securely commodified. The reason Arthur has a problem with this is that he wrongly thinks that such an assumption must deny all subjectivity to workers, and because he thinks that the class struggle that is so present in history must for some reason be diminished if it is not also given a central position in systematic dialectics. This latter concern, I believe, stems from inadequate attention to articulating the relations between systematic and historical dialectics as distinct levels of analysis. In other words, Arthur at times gets sucked into the very logical-historical method that he explicitly rejects. For if the levels are distinct, the reification at the level of systematic dialectics that subsumes labour to capital can, at the level of historical analysis, always be resisted and even radically transformed. 9"
Do others on the list recognize this as a critique that could be extended to others? How can/should it be answered?
In solidarity, Jerry
- [OPE-L] Hans Singer (1910-2006), glevy Tue 04 Apr 2006, 13:05 GMT
- [OPE-L] Hayek essay contest, Jurriaan Bendien Mon 03 Apr 2006, 20:38 GMT
- [OPE-L] Fwd URPE: Unsustainability of US trade deficit], Alejandro Valle Baeza Mon 03 Apr 2006, 03:02 GMT
- [OPE-L] Marx? Engels quote, dlaibman Sun 02 Apr 2006, 22:36 GMT
- Re: [OPE-L] Albritton on Arthur, Christopher Arthur Sun 02 Apr 2006, 16:07 GMT
- [OPE-L] Albritton on Arthur, Hans G. Ehrbar Sun 02 Apr 2006, 17:31 GMT
- Re: [OPE-L] Albritton on Arthur, Jerry Levy Mon 03 Apr 2006, 13:26 GMT
- Re: [OPE-L] Sexuality, Rationality & Irrationality under Capitalism, Jerry Levy Sun 02 Apr 2006, 15:43 GMT
- <Possible follow-up(s)>
- [OPE-L] Sexuality, Rationality & Irrationality under Capitalism, Jurriaan Bendien Mon 03 Apr 2006, 17:14 GMT