Re: [Marxism] The Derivatives Game By RALPH NADER

["Fred Feldman" <ffeldman@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Les wrote to David, who cited and quoted in full a Counterpunch contribution
by Ralph Nader:
you bet ... clip your quoted text before sending your reply.

Les wrote to Shane Mage, who had quoted the same text in his reply to David:
am i talking to myself here? i am putting you on moderation until you 
show you can clip quoted text. same for other long-timers.

The problem here is not the warning which should have been directed to
Shane. The problem is the initial criticism of David, who had published
something that had not appeared on the list before, as far as my limited
research can tell. And criticisms of David's contribution would have no
meaning without access to the article. I will add further that articles that
have not been provided in full hardly ever get seriously discussed on the
list, as D. Bach-Mozart among many others can attest.

This is why I tend to provide the full text, to the extent that the list and
provider norms allow, of articles that I think deserve discussion or at
least serious thought. My experience is that only those parts of the article
that are directly provided to the list members will be seriously discussed.
I don't blame people who have other things to do than carry out minor
research projects on the web (sometimes with flawed urls) to debate issues.

Even if it turns out that the Nader article was posted a couple of hundred
posts ago, and David Thorstad forgot it. He did not regard his post as a
"re:" or at least did not include this signal that he was quoting copy that
was already available on the list.

So the warning, if any, should have been directed against Shane for
REPEATING David's useful provision of the Nader article, which I did not
read until he provided it. And no criticism at all should have been directed
at David, as far as I can see.

I think David is wrong. It is not news that Nader has not rejected
capitalism. It is not a shock to me, who supported him in 2004 when he
played a heroic role against Bush and Kerry. I admit that this has something
to do with my preference this year for McKinney whose campaign has deeper
Black and working class roots than Nader's. But I consider both to be
supportable alternatives, and I do not campaign for McKinney against Nader,
but for McKinney against the imperialist parties.

My vote, for political reasons that I have made clear, is a vote for
McKinney-Clemente, but I view the Nader vote as basically motion, and I have
no doubt larger numbers in terms of votes, in the same general direction.
Fred Feldman





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