Re: [Marxism] zizek on tibet and china

[John <johnedmundson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On Sun, 2008-04-20 at 18:03 -0400, Ruthless Critic of All that Exists
wrote:
> On Sun, Apr 20, 2008 at 4:01 PM, Paula <Paula_cerni@xxxxxxx> wrote:
> > Ruthless asked:
> >
> > > What are some such brutally anti-democratic policies that the "decent
> >  > leftists and liberals" support?
> >
> >  For example, the policy of bombing, invading and occupying other people's
> >  countries .
> 
> Bombing, invading and occupying are horrible and require our
> condemnation. However, I'm not sure we can characterize these as
> "anti-democratic".

> As Louis Proyect usefully reminded us, leftists do not and should not
> act on the basis of poll data. For example, most Panamanians
> (according to opinion polls at the time prior to invasion) welcomed
> the US invasion of PÃnama. So, one could argue that the invasion of
> Panama was, actually, objectively a "democratic" policy. Most Iraqis
> today (according to opinion polls), similarly, do not wish the
> American troops to leave immediately. So the "democratic" policy would
> be for the US to keep occupying Iraq for some more time.
> 
> Surely, as leftists, we cannot be expected to endorse such policies,
> no matter how "democratic" they might seem. We need to call for
> withdrawal. We would have (and did) oppose the invasion of PÃnama.

Except that, assuming that the polls were correct, the people doing the
invading of Panama, Iraq etc didn't give a shit about what the majority
in those countries thought, so that's hardly relevant.
Cheers,
John



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