Re: [Marxism] Brazil's Lula meets Fidel Castro, offers credit

[Live session user <johnedmundson@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On Thu, 2008-01-17 at 00:39 -0500, Walter Lippmann wrote:

> The motives of capitalist governments, capitalist
> businesses and capitalist individuals may include
> any number of goal. Sometimes it's just to make 
> money through sales and investment. Sometimes it's
> to try to bring about social change in the places 
> the do business with.

In this case, the latter seems to have been pretty clearly expressed.

> But you pound away constantly against countries who
> do business with, invest in, and grant credits to
> Cuba. 
> 
> What, exactly do YOU propose that Cuba do, since you
> are opposed to what Cuba DOES do economically?

The points Louis raised are similar to some that I've been thinking
about for a long time too.

I haven't noticed anyone "pound away constantly against countries who do
business with, invest in, and grant credits to Cuba", any more or less
than they do about other capitalist countries, other than to clarify
their views as to whether or not they are capitalist. So people
criticise Lula for implementing neo-liberal economic policies and for
sending troops to Haiti for example. They criticise China for
reinstating capitalism - talking left (although not much of that either
these days) while walking right.

What they don't do is criticise those countries *because* they "do business
with, invest in, and grant credits to Cuba". Few and far between on this list 
would be people who support the blockade. That doesn't mean though that they
like comments from blockade breaking countries about "bringing Cuba back into 
the fold" in this transitional period after Fidel. That strikes me as a pretty
unambiguous statement. Any attempt to "bring Cuba back into the fold" has to 
be an act of counterrevolution surely? So trading with Cuba is not in itself a
bad thing, but neither is it an act of revolutionary solidarity, so dressing it
up as such is not particularly helpful, either by Lula, his minions, or people 
on a Marxism list.

Raul and Fidel obviously welcome any act by a country that undermines the 
blockade but I doubt they are unaware that it brings with it huge risks. The 
greatest help Cuba could get, and I'm sure Fidel has made this point before, 
would be the deepening of the revolution in Venezuela, because that would truly 
break the blockade by bringing about non-capitalist "trade" between those 
countries, and possibly bring closer the possibility of meaningful unification 
within Latin America. It's possible that at that point Lula would either become
a small mention in the history books or be driven to the left himself. Castro 
and
Chavez both seem to express greater faith in him than I do. I sincerely hope 
they're right.
Cheers,
John


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