Re: [Marxism] China and Russia (Was: Marxmailistas, etc.)

[Marvin Gandall <marvgandall@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Walter writes:

> China today is a bureaucratically deformed workers state...
>Capitalism has made many inroads, but does not, yet, control the
> army and the national financial system....
> Will capitalism prevail in the long run? That is possible, it's entirely
> possible. Russia is today a capitalist country...Why is it so urgent, so
> important, for those
> demanding this, that China be branded a capitalist country?
==============================
I don't think it's a matter of urgency to decide whether China has become
capitalist or whether it is still, as you say, a .deformed workers.state
since I think everyone would defend it against US imperialism, whatever its
character, and that is what would matter.

But  your characterization of China as still somehow being a workers state,
deformed or otherwise, leads you to put a gloss on the regime which is not
warranted, and seems to blinker you about to its intentions and trajectory,
even though you acknowlege that "capitalism has made many inroads" and that
it's "entirely possible" it will prevail.

For example, this thread began with an item about Walmart being forced to
accept ACFTU branches in its workplaces, which I don't think anyone said was
a bad thing, and I said was a step forward in that it could create the
conditions for possible further advance. What was challenged was your
comment that Walmart was much more than that - that the move demonstrated
that this was a country which "had a government which encouraged workers to
join trade unions", that "China's government is led by a bunch of
COMMUNISTS". You may have backed off that position since then, and I hope
so, because it reflects, IMO, a misunderstanding of the nature of both the
Chinese leadership and the state-sponsored union federation, and the
significance of introducing the union into Walmart which, despite the
company's public protestations, was itself probably closely involved in the
decision.

Of more general interest, why would you characterize Russia as a capitalist
and China as a workers' state, deformed or otherwise? They both seem
essentially alike to me. You say the difference lies in "control of the army
and the national financial system". But the old Red Army was never
dissolved, only renamed, and is much under the state control of former
Soviet Communists as the PLA is in China. Both governments have privatized
large sections of their economies in whole or in part. The Chinese financial
system, in fact, is the latest and most prized sector to opened to foreign
capitalists.who are eager to dominate it.it. What is expected to be the
largest IPO in history is scheduled for later this month when Goldman Sachs
will lead the bidding for close to $20 billion of shares in the Industrial
and Commercial Bank, China's biggest.



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