Re: [Marxism] Chechnya: what Proyect wrote back 1999...

["David Quarter" <davidquarter@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

From:                   Louis Proyect <lnp3@xxxxxxxxx>


> David Quarter wrote:
> >  Again, you didn't really address the issue of U.S. involvement in
> > the Caucasus. Just more of the usual demagoguery.
>
> Yes, that Lenin stuff was highly demagogic, I have to admit. Finding a
> quote that demonstrated his commitment to the right of the Soviet
> republics in the Caucuses to secede unconditionally was a cheap
> debater's trick I sprang on you.

 Exactly my point. And glad to know that you need Lenin to do own
your thinking. I suppose it's better than Frank Rich.

btw, here's an interesting quote I dug up today from your
namesake. You might take these words to heart, particularly the
very last clause:

"I'd recommend
alt.politics.socialism.trotsky on usenet. I would say this, however,
rehashing the Stalin-Trotsky debate is generally a sign of a retreat
from the challenge of understanding the world you are living in right
now."


>
> > It's also interesting that you ignored the point in my post about
> > Tibet and religion (which you also clipped from your reponse).
>
> I am not sure that it is worth my time to dig into the whole question of
> Tibet. >>>>

 Yes, I wouldn't want you to go to the trouble, especially now that
you've dug yourself into such a deep hole...



I will say this, however. You seem to be under the impression
> that I view China as a socialist country.>>>>

 I wasn't necessarily under that impression. I certainly have an
impression as to where you stand on Tibet. And It is certaintly not
on the side of the "oppressed masses", that is, of course,
assuming things haven't changed in China, in your mind at least,
since 2003. Remember, I have access to the internet...


You evidently didn't read my
> post on the Hart-Landsberg/Burkett MR article.<<<<

 Don't find the time to read much of what you write, fortunately.

 It might be interesting
> to review the Chinese policy on Tibet during the Mao era, but I have
> more pressing tasks in front of me<<<<

 Yes, I'm sure Columbia and your moderating chores keep you
quite busy.


 If you think that what Mao or Mao
> did not do justifies the killing of up to one out of ten Chechens>>>>

 Putting words into my mouth...


 then
> be my guest. It wouldn't surprise me, seeing the political trajectory of
> fellow conspiracist Jared Israel>>>>

  Doesn't warrant a response...

 It is certainly not recognizable as
> Marxism.>>>>

  It's hurts to know that, Lou. Btw, weren't you the one lecturing our
 friend Tony A. about not lectuing others about what it entails to be
a "true" marxist?

>
> >  It certaintly demonstrates the contradiction of your position on  
> > "oppressed minorities",
> > so maybe that explains why.
>
> I don't have my own position on oppressed nationalities.>>>>

 Sorry. Lenin's...


What I have I
> stole from Lenin.>>>>

  At least you acknowledge this...

 I don't know exactly how to put this, but I find Lenin
> more useful than Rick Rozoff, Jim Yarker or Jared Israel>>>>

  And because Lenin wrote something back in 1900 (and what?)
and we on the other hand are living in the year 2004 and discussing
a conflict taking place in the year 2004 and since Marxism is of
course a static theory,  this would obviously prove your point...

 I'm starting to understand you better now...

Btw, I know that Lenin never adjusted his views to actual
conditions, so he would most certainly agree with you on this...


Also, try to
> use your delete key next time when you respond to a lengthy post of mine
> or when you are posting some X-Files type speculation from an outfit
> like RosBusinessConsulting that is already on the Internet. It is on the
> righthand side of your keyboard. We are trying to preserve bandwidth here..>>>

 Must have been feeling lazy, Lou...My apologies.

Will take your suggestion into consideration...

DOQ


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