[Marxism] Re: US SWP participation in UK anti-war protests

[David Walters <dwalters@xxxxxxxxxx>]

Peter,
  You assume that Louis drove the SWP symp off the list. This is false.
I agree, Louis did not handle it well...when bringing in a 10 lb.
stripped bass with 8lb test line, you don't start reeling the fish in
hard, you set a light drag, let the fish take the line out and tire,
and the GENTLY reel 'er in. Louis likes the reel 'er in fast and chance
the line won't break. The person who wrote in was approaching the
issues  she raised very honestly and others, including me, were dealing
with the her in an honest fashion. Eventually she couldn't deal with
the *totality of the criticism*...not just Louis'.

On the CL work in the demonstrations in the UK...is not unlike their
work here in the USA, since we're talking the same organization, the
same press, the same books, etc. Parameters are important to discuss,
Peter, wouldn't you agree? The parameters of the CL/SWP are, and not to
be to technical about it, political nut-jobs. You KNOW this, yet you
try to find the honey inside outhouse anyway. They are in the UK, a
dozen or so clones of the US SWP who oppose these demonstrations from
from the get-go. They argue that there is "no revolution" going on in
Iraq, ergo the demands for US withdrawal are of little consequence.
I've discussed this with them here. They are loony on this and don't
deserve this respect you seek to heap on them.

"Communist" work at these demonstrations? Yes, look at the SSP, don't
look at the CL.  They are not communists since they are
sectarians...through and through...Marx, Communist Manifesto, read same.

"Inter-imperialist rivalry"? Where, Iraq? This is their excuse NOT to
condemn Blair? Really? Ugh, double ugh. This is from the same soup that
has "The USA lost the cold war" written all over it? You expect me to
take these guys seriously? Russia is workers state? Do you really want
to debate this? THEY do...!

Ireland. Yes, good one there...and it's where, BTW, the SSP legacy in
old Militant/CWI is going to bite them for sure, it's already having a
small effect. The SSP needs to abandon their abstentionist
proto-Militant view on the British occupation of Ireland and say so
loud and clear. And yes, the SWP-US has the correct "position"...but it
will not have an iota of influence. The MIM in the US has the same
position...and it's worth the same as the SWP's...zero, since they have
no audience at all, refuse to participate in the class struggle and all
the other things we've talked about on this list ad-nauseum for years.

Pathfinder literature. Using you method, selling "Europe and America:
Two
Speeches on Imperialism" is to be commended. OK, I know something, a
little bit really, about the distribution of Trotsky's works. Using the
same method, Peter, what's the difference between buying the same
literature from, say,  the ISO, the Sparts and the Pathfinder
International? I know one...the ISO or the UK-SWP actually BUILDS the
demonstrations that Pathfinderites attend to sell literature to people
who the same Pathfinderites *don't want to be there*. So...the CL and
the SL are basically the same thing, based on your method I think. Oh
yeah, they don't "push" Trotsky, the push Jack Barnes...actually hawk
his book, on the class struggle in the US.

David Walters