Re: Reply to: Re: Capitalist collectivizatio

[Louis N Proyect <lnp3@xxxxxxxxxxxx>]

On Fri, 26 Apr 1996, boddhisatva wrote:
>
>       Who do you think wiped out the wolf and the mountain lion in the
> West, Archer-Daniels-Midland?  Who opposes the re-introduction of the wolf
> now, Armour?  It is and was small ranchers who are over-invested and have
> to squeeze every last nickel from their land.  You are living in a dream
> world of agrarian peace and love.  Why don't you take a drive down
> south and ask a peach picker, or a tomato picker how they like the local
> "family farmer".
>

Louis: I think this debate has reached the point of diminishing returns
and this will be my last post on it. Boddhisatva is on a list where most
people have a Marxist view of history. They see things in class terms.
The tendency to oppose "good guys" to "bad guys" has nothing to do with
Marxism. Archer-Midland is taking over the world for reasons that Marx
carefully explained in the Communist Manifesto. The idea is to
expropriate the big bourgeoisie and allow society to make investment
decisions *not the market*.

>From a political standpoint this means taking up the cause of small
proprietors who are being mauled by the big bourgeoisie whether they are
family farmers or campesinos in Central America. The ultimate goal is
highly efficient and technologically advanced means of production. The
contradictory aspect of all this is that socialism must defend those
whose mode of production is not advanced at all in order to accomplish
proletarian revolution. Marxism has understood this throughout its entire
history.

Boddhisatva, in his embrace of the market, sets himself against most
people on this list. That is his privilege. It is an unmoderated list. I
just have to question what he expects to get out of this. I would not
participate in an Anarchism list. Why would I try to argue down people
whose beliefs are founded on concrete? Anybody who is an anarchist or a
Marxist in this society must be exceedingly strong-willed. Why would we
be persuaded by a Boddhisatva when we hear the same sort of thing in a
million different places?

People like Carnell and Boddhisatva remind me of the white male students who
sign up for women's studies or black studies classes who have no interest
in the discussion except to poke holes in the instructor's lectures and
argue with other students. On Marxism 1, we can do nothing but give
Boddhisatva an occasional biff and then move on to more important topics.
On Marxism 2, which is more like one of those black or women's studies
classes, he got thrown out of the classroom. What a loser.


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