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Re: Mumia Abu-Jamal, & Police Enmity
- Subject: Re: Mumia Abu-Jamal, & Police Enmity
- From: afn02065@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx (Matt Davidson)
- Date: Tue, 06 Jun 1995 10:45:52 -0400
David Patterson, always alert for the dreaded "Stalinism" writes:
>Regarding the jack-booted police and their evil ways, it is interesting to
>consider how closely the opinions of Alfred, Jerry, and Matt parallel, or
>collapse into, the opinions held by far-rightest militia members in the
>U.S. That said, shall we begin a thread for the defense of Mr. McVeigh?
>He "got some cops," eh Alfred?
As I mentioned in my post, defending Mumia, McVeigh, or Ted Bundy is a
political question first and foremost, not a moral/aesthetic (Mumia cute,
death penalty ugly) one. It's not clear to me how wasting any time
defending McVeigh or Bundy raises revolutionary political issues in general,
or in specific illustrates one of many examples of how the cops, the courts,
and the state in general fuck people over--as perhaps defending Mumia does.
I certainly don't sit at home at night and wait for the UN helicopters to
come and take me away :).
>And Matt, regarding the exemplary Stalinist reasoning displayed in your
>post of the 5th of June: If you're willing to sacrifice cops for the
>revolution, who else are you willing to sacrifice? Everyone in uniform?
>With a badge? EMS technicians who try to _save_ cops, and others, when
>they've been shot? Doctors? Would you shoot a cop yourself? Under what
>conditions?
A cop is a soldier in the army of the capitalists. Both in the general
sense in which the state monopolizes violence on behalf of the ruling class,
and organizes this violence in the form of regular military, National Guard,
police, etc. and in the specific sense that their attitudes and actions
especially in racially and economically oppressed communities are basically
identical to those of an occupying army.
In a war soldiers die. (And occasionally army medics, maybe
even--gasp!--army doctors, die.) The question now is not whether it's good
or bad in some abstract sense whether or not a cop is shot, but whether or
not its part of a winning strategy. I'd say just shooting a cop on a street
corner is not right now part of a winning strategy. That is the position
from which it should be criticized. Not out of some sort of "moral
revulsion" at the sad fate of a dead enemy soldier.
(Of course the point with Mumia is mostly that he didn't shoot anybody.
It's just a straight frame up.)
>Would you shoot a Marxist who tried to defend a cop?
Yes, in the military phase of the class struggle. Anybody may call
themselves a Marxist. If for them that includes aid and comfort to the
enemy in a combat situation, or defending mercenaries of the old regime from
popular justice, it isn't worth much as a label.
>Have you ever dialed 911? Do you live in the center of a city? If your
>children were being attacked by a violent criminal, would you dial? Do
>you believe that criminals, by virtue of reasons other than political,
>exist (or should the word _criminal_ always take quotation marks)? Would
>you consider my green grocer who was recently shot dead in the course of a
>"robbery" to be the victim of an "economic freedom fighter"?
Yes. Yes, a small city now (Gainesville), a larger city before
(Cleveland)--how many city points does that add up to? Yes--hell, when I
myself was being threatened by a violent criminal I called. That cops have
a double responsibility as capitalist enforcers--keeping a boot on the neck
of the most explosive elements of society, especially those under a dual
burden of racial and economic oppression; and responding (generally after
the fact and in a lackadaisical fashion) to social crime that exists
primarily as a result of capitalism--isn't something I came up with. Maybe
next time I should call you?
Alfred's post did sort of obscure the boundaries between political "crime"
and social crime. He was speaking specifically of Mumia, and it wasn't
really germane to his point. I think that most crime is "political" only in
the broadest sense, in that it exists as a result of the kind of society
capitalism has created. That doesn't mean its okay, or that it should be
celebrated. But our unhappiness with it has to go beyond "bad criminal, go
to jail" to an indictment of the system which breeds it. Social criminals
are not revolutionaries, I agree. So my condolences to the friends and
families of the greengrocer.
>A second interesting observation: those who wish the most violent, complete,
>and sudden overthrow of late global capitalism seem to be the least
>willing, or able, to realistically consider the precise ramifications of
>their wishes.
Are these friends of yours or something? Did I accidentally delete part of
your post? What are you talking about?
>In this way do individuals with such sensibilities parallel another social
>group, one defined by its members' age and mental capacity. From whom
>else (other than "tough" stars of Hollywood "action movies") would you
>expect to hear the words "Even a nice pig is still bacon-in-waiting"?
Yes, God forbid the capitalists and their lackeys be subjected to contempt,
let alone violence! Why they're the salt of the earth. I weep every night
to think that some unfortunate Detroit cop might chip a nail while beating
some kid to death with his flashlight.
>And so the discussion surrounding the urgent and serious matter of a man's
>life has degenerated into (in the accurate formulation of Rob) a "Marxism
>of the playpen." The chat rooms for youngsters on AOL are to your
>right....
How is that remark constructive?
Do you agree or disagree that "the urgent and serious matter of a man's
life"--be it Mumia's or some cop's--is a political question, and not an
(abstract) moral one? Do you agree or disagree that where cops stand as a
group is a question that can be discussed? Do you agree or disagree that
while we can distinguish between political "crime" and social crime, the
latter is primarily a function of capitalism? Do you agree or disagree that
the total number of victims of social crime pales beside the number of lives
destroyed by the everyday, normal workings of capitalism? Do you think
violence has a place in the revolution?
--Matt D.
--- from list marxism@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ---
------------------
- Thread context:
- conferences,
Bruce . Lindsay Tue 06 Jun 1995, 06:50 GMT
- Value - role of gremlins,
Chris Burford Tue 06 Jun 1995, 05:37 GMT
- The Law of Value Again (fwd),
glevy Tue 06 Jun 1995, 03:07 GMT
- Re: Mumia Abu-Jamal, & Police Enmity,
David Klepser Patterson Tue 06 Jun 1995, 01:49 GMT
- <Possible follow-up(s)>
- Re: Mumia Abu-Jamal, & Police Enmity,
Matt Davidson Tue 06 Jun 1995, 14:45 GMT
- Re: Mumia Abu-Jamal, & Police Enmity,
glevy Tue 06 Jun 1995, 15:34 GMT
- Re: Mumia Abu-Jamal, & Police Enmity,
Alfred Joseph Tue 06 Jun 1995, 17:55 GMT
- Re: Mumia Abu-Jamal, & Police Enmity,
Bryan A. Alexander Tue 06 Jun 1995, 19:15 GMT
- The Law of Value Again,
glevy Tue 06 Jun 1995, 00:45 GMT
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