Re: [A-List] How "scientific" is science?

["tony black" <tal@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Not to pronounce authoritatively...but from what I understand of those
scientists disputing the 'isolation' of the virus, they point out that the
human genome is replete with its own endogenous retroviral fragments and
that it is likely these that are being proffered as HIV. Notice in that in
the abstracted paper you forwarded it mentions only 'particles'....The point
is, show me a paper that fulfills Koch's postulates, the historical and
scientific standard for demonstrating isolation of a virus.

T.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hayduke" <hayduke@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "The A-List" <a-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, December 17, 2005 1:12 PM
Subject: Re: [A-List] How "scientific" is science?


>    QED
>
> on 12/17/2005 10:00 AM, bar@xxxxxxxxxxx at bar@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
>
> > The hiv virus is not documented at all. I challenge you to present one
> > published scientific paper where it is claimed it has been found.
>
> EMBO J. 2003 Apr 1;22(7):1707-15
>
>    Structural organization of authentic, mature HIV-1 virions and cores.
> Briggs JA, Wilk T, Welker R, Krausslich HG, Fuller SD.
>
> The Wellcome Trust Centre for Human Genetics, Division of Structural
> Biology, University of Oxford, Roosevelt Drive, Headington, Oxford OX3
> 7BN,
> UK.
>
> Mature, infectious HIV-1 particles contain a characteristic cone-shaped
> core
> that encases the viral RNA and replication proteins. The architectures of
> mature virions and isolated cores were studied using cryo-electron
> microscopy. The average size ( approximately 145 nm) of the virion was
> unchanged during maturation. Most virions contained a single core but
> roughly one-third contained two or more cores. Consideration of the capsid
> protein concentration during core assembly indicated that core formation
> in
> vivo is template-mediated rather than concentration-driven. Although most
> cores were conical, 7% were tubular. These displayed a stacked-disc
> arrangement with 7-, 8-, 9- or 10-fold axial symmetry. Layer line
> filtration
> of these images showed that the capsid subunit arrangement is consistent
> with a 9.6 nm hexamer resembling that previously seen in the helical tubes
> assembled from purified capsid protein. A common reflection (1/3.2 nm)
> shared between the tubular and conical cores suggested they share a
> similar
> organization. The extraordinary flexibility observed in the assembly of
> the
> mature core appears to be well suited to accommodating variation and hence
> there may be no single structure for the infectious virion.
> PMID: 12660176 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
>
>
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