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[Fwd: Re: [A-List] Conference in China]





-------- Original Message --------
Subject: 	Re: [A-List] Conference in China
Date: 	Sat, 18 Sep 2004 15:33:30 -0400
From: 	Henry C.K. Liu <hliu@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: 	The A-List <a-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
References: 	<B52C1E7AE3795B499FF6DD3C957E762E01158605@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>



I encourage Jim to write and record his impressions and thoughts on his
recent trip to China.  It should be noted that Jim's host was the ultra
neo-liberal stronghold of Tsinghua University, practically a transplant
of the American Enterprise Institute or Cato.  Besides, Huey Newton was
not wrong about China in the 1970's.  Visitors are always faced with
seeing a glass half full or half empty.  What he saw in China was what
he wanted to see to reinforce his own struggle with US racist
capitalism. Newton died in a dispute over drugs within a decade after he
returned from exile on condition that he would reject his early
revolutionary zeal and was awarded a Ph. D. by the
University of California.  That fact only testifies to the heoplessness
of abandoning the revolution.  It did not testify to Newton being a waek
drug addict.  Drug addition was a program of weapons of mass destruction
the US system released on the Black population. His personal tragedy did
not distract from his early achievement in the Black Panther Party.
http://www.blackpanther.org/TenPoint.htm

http://www.itsabouttimebpp.com/International/Returning_from_China.html

The fact remains that while events in China were not particularly
affected by the visit of the leader of Black revolutionaries in the US,
the revolutionary events, with all their blemishes, in fact affected and
strengthened the development of revolutionary ideology of these
revoltionaries, such as Malcom X, Robert Williams, etc.

Williams relocated to China in 1966 during the height of the Cultural
Revolution. There as in Cuba Williams enjoyed a celebrity status and
fraternized with Mao Zedong and Chou En Lai. His interest in Maoist
revolutionary thought found its way into The Crusader, which continued
to reach an influential underground audience among Black Power militants
in the United States.

Profound influence on the Black Power movement

In spite of his exile, Robert Williams's influence was profound. His
emphasis on situating the American civil rights struggle in the context
of international liberation movements gained wide acceptance, as did his
philosophy of armed resistance. His militant rhetorical style-vigorous,
colorful, and vitriolic-was emulated throughout the movement. A
dedicated network of Williams's followers in America established
organizations such as the Revolutionary Action Movement and the Republic
of New Africa to promote his militant philosophy among intellectuals and
activists. The Black Panther Party's public posture of the armed
militant was consciously influenced by Williams's vision.

Withdrawal from leadership after returning to the United States

In 1969, Robert Williams returned to the United States with the quiet
acquiescence of none other than President Richard Nixon. This was done
as a gesture of goodwill in the President's efforts to cultivate the
Chinese leadership for his historic visit to China, even though the FBI
had warned Nixon that Williams could likely fill the role of
assassinated civil rights leaders, Malcolm X and Martin Luther King.

But after assessing the state of the movement in 1970, rife with
maddening internecine ideological divisions, and murders and
incarceration of numerous black militants, Williams, now disillusioned,
withdrew from all but nominal leadership in the militant groups that
were founded in his name. The material on his disillusionment with the
movement is a subject of vast research significance in and of itself.

Williams became a research associate at the Institute for Chinese
Studies at University of Michigan. He and Mabel moved to the remote,
historically integrated, Michigan township of Baldwin, where they
remained for the rest of his life. In Baldwin, the Williamses continued
their dedication to social transformation, focusing on the local level.
His role as a national leader subsided, but his image among the
succeeding generation of black power advocates remains profound. Like
the black folk hero "John Henry," Robert F. Williams outwitted and
tormented the oppressors of African Americans.

http://www.lexisnexis.com/academic/2upa/Aaas/bpower.asp

Being co-opted by the system is a fatal disease for a revolutionary.

Henry C.K. Liu

Craven, Jim wrote:

Dear Friend,

I am back from China--for the moment. I understand your words and agree
with them fully. I was/am very aware of how ignorant I am of the many
realities, dimension and conditions of China--past and rpesent and how
little I saw in my short time in China. But I was also outside of
Beijing and am someone who has lived and traveled extensively in the
so-called "Third World" (in six languages other than English) and am
therefore perhaps more aware than some outside of China how limited my
knowledge is. The paper I presented
(http://www.marxmail.org/CravenChina.htm) was received and passed around
fully and my discussions were extended, candid and full with scholars
who know China far beyond Beijing. Also, in order to protect confidences
of those with whom I met, I did not write all that I could have written;
I too must practice "shen chang bu lu."

Thank you,

Jim


-----Original Message----- From: a-list-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:a-list-bounces@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Xenon Zi-Neng Yuan Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2004 10:42 AM To: The A-List Subject: Re: [A-List] Conference in China


It warms my heart to see some first-hand reporting from China that strays from the usual formula of alleging how universally "miserable" the situation is over there. I do commend comrade Craven for daring to see beyond the anti-China media filter which so poisons the discussion here in the "West". Assuming you are still in China, I wish you well and in full confidence that the experience will continue to shatter the many inadvertent misconceptions implanted in your mind by the western media and intelligentsia, as it was with me.

That being said, I do hope that you would consider spending some
extended
time beyond a "model" city like Beijing.  In some ways (and I say this
with
all due respect), your report reminded me a little bit of Huey Newton's
remembrances of his visit to the PRC in the 70's, in that a more
skeptical
person may think you're just getting a sanctioned tour of the "pretty
side
of town".

More comments below...



The first thing I should note is that I was asked to provide on an
abstract of my paper not the whole paper. It was on my own initiative


and


out of respect for those who had invited me that I sent a copy of the
whole paper before leaving for China. This was because I did not want,


due


to my own ignorance or misinformation, to say things that were


incorrect


and/or might cause any problems for those who had invited me. My


concerns


were unfounded as no one tried to censor me in any way and all were
prepared for a free full and no-holds-barred discussion of any and all
issues related to China (including those issues raised in the Monthly
Review issue on China).



I had similar preconceived notions to yours on my first visit several years ago, ignorantly assuming that truly open discussion and debate would be hard to come by, especially in more publicized settings. It is amazing how inundated we in the imperial centers become with images of China being some sort of Orwellian police state, with tapped phones and thought police around every corner.



I got a cut on my foot and my foot and leg became infected. The last
time
this happened, when I was in India, I got staph infection throughout my





left leg and damn near lost it. This time it was my right foot and leg.


I


got to experience the Chinese health care system which I would


recommend


to anyone; they are far advanced of the U.S. and Canada in many ways;


and


they are also very aware that health care is not evenly distributed
throughout China and are very intent on dealing with it as a priority
issue. The first thing that impressed me tremendously, is that I had to





wait in line and no effort was given to give me "special treatment" as


a


visitor; I really appreciated that. Secondly, the doctors were thorough





and took the issue of my own immune system not being adapted to China


very


seriously. Thirdly they did regular follow-up (again, each time I


waited


my turn in line) and gave me antibiotics simply not available in the


West


(including a bottle, prescribed for me by the doctor to take home to
continue my treatment).



Was this in the Beijing metropolitan area? Again, while I have no disagreements that a foreigner should have no qualms about getting public health care in the city, the uneven distribution of these services in the countryside does make it harder to come to the same conclusion for other

areas of China.  Granted, I myself have simply been fortunate not to
have
gotten sick or injured when in the countryside, and do not have my own
first-hand experience.  But I do get mixed reports from friends and
peers
who have - which at least is better than the daily multiple horror
stories
which saturate the headlines and inner pages of the bourgeois press
(especially the overseas Chinese language press, such as the World
Journal/Shijie Ribao).



As a former taxi driver myself--full-time--I of course knew well the
pressures and realities of the taxi drivers all over the world (wait in





long lines for a short trip and having to pay the daily lease or "nut"


on


the vehicle, all sorts of freaks giving you trouble etc) but the taxi
drivers in Beijing will not take tips as they believe that this might
involve "looking down" on them or pity. Despite their low pay and
difficult conditions of work, they had a certain pride and dignity


about


them that reflected socialist consciousness is alive and well among the





taxi drivers in China.



tipping/gratuity is indeed a practice that was generally eradicated prior to the market "reforms". However, it has made a comeback since then, particularly in some of the fancier restaurants/hotels and other service

related jobs (such as the more expensive taxis and limos) catering to
the
wealthy (both domestic and foreign) or even middle class.  I don't
disagree
that some level of "socialist consciousness" persists amongst the common

workers, but in my own conversations with many of them, I'd regretfully
have to say that this is far from universally true.  A great many of
them
are caught up in "money-making" fever and recite, like mantras, the
precepts of "getting rich is glorious" capitalism...



I hooked-up with some friends of a friend and they took me to a
restaurant
called Xiang Yang Tun (Face the Sun) which features artifacts from
traditional villages, traditional village recipes, posters and


newspapers
from the Cultural Revolution,


large posters of Chairman Mao and acrobat/comedy troupes from


northeastern


China. That was truly memorable.



Again, unfortunately, places like that are "novelty" destinations. In mainstream urban China, I'd say that the Cultural Revolution is not popular. This is different in the countryside, of course. Respect for Mao on the other hand, is becoming universal again I think (though grudgingly for some), particularly when the issue of China's sovereignty comes up.



On CCTV-9 the English channel in Beijing, the programming was very
thoughtful and informative, >From discussions of life and history


during


the Tang Dynasty, to national policies to protect the survival and
existence of the 55 non-Han national groups in China (e.g Dai People in





Yunnan), to long programs about China's and global energy requirements


and


trends, to programs on industrial pollution and ecological damage and
ongoing demonstrations in the U.S. against Bush. It was such a relief


to


see programming that did not focus on and celebrate narcissism,
competition, social darwinism, humiliation, intrigue, careerism,
ultra-individualism,  sexism, racism, national chauvinism,
machiavellianism, etc etc.



CCTV programming is often as you describe, though with some exceptions, especially the non-English stations. In addition, most people in the cities can get other channels; local channels and Taiwan/HK-affiliated networks will more often than not contain many of the more unsavory elements you list above.



In Chinese language and culture, there is the concept of  "shen chang
bu
lu" (keeping ones words and intentions modest and moderate and not


letting


out all one is thinking). Perhaps that is what I was experiencing while


in


China, or, perhaps, the same concept should be considered in any


possibly


precipitous judgments about the extent of restoration of capitalism
allegedly going on in China. The Chinese I met did not run from a full
debate of the question and were/are prepared to debate the issue in the





future of what they are doing in China and why.



Agreed. Rash judgements and proclamations from those of us in the imperial center about the processes in China are to be avoided. Like Melvin has stated numerous times both here and elsewhere, on such matters it is better to err on the side of caution, lest we find ourselves trumpeting the call of the most reactionary elements of our imperialist bourgeoisie.

xzy













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