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Re: [A-List] FW: znet/weisbrot on deflation - critique?



You need to understand that fiat money is not funny money.  It is backed
by the asset of the issuing nation.  Prudence in this case will be
measured by the size of the economy, not some grandmother admonishment.

The fact that government issued money is government credit does not mean
that government can spend without limits. The limits is the national
wealth. If the national wealth is monetized at x units of money, that is
the limit of how much money the government can issue.  If the government
 issues x+ units of money, then the national wealth will be
re-monetized at x+ units.  If government credit is spent only on
productive enterprises, meaning those enterprises that lead to economic
growth, then there is no limit to how much  money the government can
issue, as long as the rate of money increase tracks the rate of growth.
 Also, issuing money is not the same thing as spending money. Money not
spent is merely pieces of paper.
That is what a liquidity trap is alll about. Sometimes the government
can try to increase the money supply, but broad money amount will not
increase because loans are not being made.  Merely issuing more money
can end up as pushing on a credit string.  This is why monetary policy
alone cannot solve all economic problems.

This is not a matter of true or false.  It is a matter of logical
consistency evolving around a particular but useful view of money.
Others can hold different views, but those views are less useful, if
full employment and growth are the objectives.

Henry C.K. Liu


Gary Santos wrote:

Henry,

The debate on whether money is a credit or debt is not as interesting as its
follow through ("there is no need for capital formation, because state
credit can be issued to finance them") if money is a credit. But, it gives
license to spend well beyond levels what common opinion considers prudent.
We are, after all, dealing with "fiat" whose value can be subject to a
downward change value much greater than real assets when hyperinflation sets
in.

If, indeed, money is credit and this credit can be freely spend, I fail to
see any assurances that the economic return on these patrimonial investments
will turn out higher than its economic cost, the creation of more claims on
fiat assets. Put another way, if we were to translate the concept of money
as credit into a 5 year Medium Term Plan for a developing economy, what
would it look like? Surely, the decision to spend is easier than deciding
what should be spent on. Investment in education with lousy teachers is
exactly like a badly made bridge built leading to nowhere. Both are total
wastes of money.

Gary





----- Original Message -----
From: "Henry C.K. Liu" <hliu@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <a-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2003 8:18 AM
Subject: Re: [A-List] FW: znet/weisbrot on deflation - critique?



Ann,

There is plenty of time for us for duel when our common enemy,
neo-liberalism, is defeated.

But a few comments below:

Anyutka wrote:


Sorry, Jim, but your analysis is based not on a critique of capitalism,

but

on one of central banking. Only in a monetarily, centrally-planned

economy

(which central banking creates) in which the medium of exchange is

declared

to be such by a government with a printing press and is bereft of

commodity

backing and therefore enters the economy as debt, is deflation a threat.
Under free market capitalism (which by definition requires

commodity-backed

money, which is based on an asset, not debt) deflation is a boon - it

clears

out malinvestments, thereby freeing capital for productive pursuits
beneficial to all.

It is true that if money acquires a fixed intrinsic value, it becomes more clear that holding it is an asset, not a debt. When government issues money, with or without backing by valuable commodities, it is issuing a credit instrument of government asset. Since all that is not yet assigned to the private sector is government asset, the government issued money has intrinsic value, more solid than gold, until the government falls or owes more foreign debt than its asset (national wealth) can afford. Through taxation, the government claim legitimately a portion of the privat sector. Now for all "productive pursuits", meaning all activities beneficial to the common goods, since avtivities beneficial to the private good cannot logically be defined as productive, although at times it is possible to have activities that are beneficial to both public and private good, which is why a private sector is permissible. Now for all productive pursuits, there is no need for capital formation, because state credit can be issued to finance them. Only non-productive private pursuits need private capital formation, being that a person enjoys the right to squander his own assets and resources, but only to a certain limit, because when we own, we do not command full authority over an asset, we only control the right to use it and pass it on to our designated heirs.

As prices fall due to increased productivity and

efficient capital allocation, the value of money grows. (As a

consequence,

so do domestic savings - the only investment capital of which any nation

can

truly be assured.) This is especially important for the working class,

who

pay the greatest price in a fiat system which can only work -

temporarily

and inefficiently - under a regime of perpetual inflation, i.e. theft.
Funny how nobody gets this right - people cheer when the value of their
homes rise, but are supposed to be threatened when the value of their

money

does the same?  The only ones truly under the gun from deflation are the
govt and their bankster allies - all scam artists, villains, and rogues
living well off the labor of others. -A.

When your house increases in price, you enjoy a monetised increase in value. When prices fall, the value of money in private hands increases but the value of money as state credit do not necessarily increase. The same face value of state credit in the form of money now command more tangible assets to redeem. In other words, the seller of the house get less money (state Credi) with which to do other things with.

Deflation is neither good or bad except for two factors.  It creates
unemployment and its shrinks the economy.  Those factors are bad for
people who need to work to make a living and for a nation which needs a
growth economy.

Valuable money is not good for those who have to do or sell things to
get moeny, which is most people.

Henry C.K. Liu

----- Original Message -----
From: "Craven, Jim" <jcraven@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <a-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, July 11, 2003 2:50 PM
Subject: [A-List] FW: znet/weisbrot on deflation - critique?




There are several reasons why deflation, especially sustained, may cause
some problems for capitalism that monetary policies or indeed fiscal
policies cannot fix. First of all deflation, or sustained decreases in

the

general price level (as opposed to disinflation or decreases in a

positive

rate of inflation) can produce dislocations in the following ways:

A) Because some business costs are relatively fixed and locked-in in the
short-run (e.g. interest rates fixed for terms of loan agreements, rents
fixed for terms of rental agreements, wage rates fixed for terms of
empoyment agreements) sustained deflation can cause a profits squeeze
leading to cumulative and self-reinforcing downward effects: e.g.

Deflation


leads to disinvestment or putting off planned investment, leading to

more

layoffs, leading to falling real incomes leading to falling aggregate

demand


leading to more deflation and falling aggregate supply (partially

cushioning


the fall in the general price level) and even further rising

unemployment...


B) Deflation can lead to expectations effects on the demand side (when
people expect lower prices or lower future incomes they decrease present
demand in anticipation of the future low incomes and/or future even

lower

prices thus creating feedback and self-fulfilling/reinforcing effects on

the


demand side leading to the same on the supply side);

C) Everybody wants to go to heaven but nobody wants to die. Everbody

wants

the prices of what they sell to go up while the prices of what they buy

to

go down but deflation doesn't work that way often. When the general

price

level is falling, or better the weighted-average price level (itself a
highly suspect construct), it does not mean that every and all prices

are

falling. Often businesses may find that prices of what they sell are

falling


while input prices are not falling as fast, not falling and/or even

rising

causing profits squeezes and or on the worker side even more dramatic
decreases in real wages thus feeding into the cumulative and
self-reinforcing spiral downward;

D) Falling general prices might stimulate some sales (in the

conventional

models, a falling general price level stimulates increases in Aggregate
Quantities Demanded leading to increases in real GDP and employment,

leading


to increases in employment and real incomes, leading to increases in
aggregate demand, profits, investment and ultimately  short-run

aggregate

supply--the anti-Keynesians start out with supply-led growth) depending

upon


the overall domestic and global contexts operating. For example, with
widening income/wealth inequalities (U.S. is number one out of 22
industrialized nations in wealth/incomes inqualities), with masses of

people


maxed-out on their credit cards, with real tax burdens being

increasingly

dumped on the so-called middle-class and below, with increasing

uncertainty


about the future (employment, real incomes, prices, interest rates,

costs

of


education, globalization effects, downsizing, outsourcing etc) among the
general mass-demand-producing segments of the population, tax cuts,
expansionary monetary policies leading to even lower interest rates etc

may


not and will likely not have the usual intended effects of stimulating
employment, output, investment, savings, moderate/necessary increases in
prices, increases in aggregate demand and short-run aggregate supply

etc.

For example, with the last supposed "tax cuts" and rebates, only about

17%

of those who got them spent them; the rest went into drawing down debt

not

into spending as predicted.

E) Often deflation is portrayed as having some positive effects on
international trade side and making prices of exports more competitive
globally and making imports relatively more expensive and less

competitive;


this is supposed to simulate net exports and even reverse some slides in

the


general exchange rate of the dollar. This assumes that prices and

relative

prices are the only or even significant basis for global demand for

exports


and imports. In the context of global recessions and widening global
inequaltiies in wealth/incomes, no matter how far prices fall, they may

well


not have any stimulative effects on net exports--especially in the

context

of nations, like U.S. citizens, maxed-out with their own credit cards;

F) Deflation can have effects on preventing future investment, business
start-ups, etc; plus, deflation is usually associated with the most

extreme


troughs of a typical business cycle (in most recessions at most we find
disinflation but actual deflation is rare since the Great Depression)

thus

having negative effects on both investor and consumer--and
saver--expectations and psychology; Further, even those deflation,
especially unexpected, favors lenders at the expense of borrowers (at

least


in theory), and helps to lower real interest rates, the bottom line is

the

bottom line and now matter how much taxes are cut, no matter how low

real

interest rates go, this will not likely simulate significant investment

in

real plant and equipment, output and jobs in the context of global and
domestic masses suffering falling real incomes and increassing debt and
unable/unwilling to demand any real output that could be produced (who

will


start up a business, no matter how cheap the borrowed money with little
prospects of effective demand); this will but stimulate more

wealth/income

inequalities and the increased hegemony of financial capital over

industrial


and agricultural capital--more paper chasing and short-run speculation.

I could go on, and notice I am looking only from the standpoint of
contradictions in bourgeois economic theory, when we bring in a

full-blown

Marxist analysis, departing from the linear and unidirectional "chains

of

causality" and ultimate "independent/dependent" variables of bullshit
neoclassicism, it gets even worse--or better from the standpoint of
destabilizing the whole system.

Got to run, more later, this is just for openers.

Jim C.
















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